I currently have a 2004 Jeep Rubicon and find myself wanting something sportier, and quicker.
My Jeep is very nice, it has a 5 spd manual and a lot of upgrades. It has a stroker 4.7L with 240 hp and 280 ft/lbs, bigger 33" dia BF Goodrich MudTerrarins, a Skyjacker 2.5" susp lift, HighRock front and rear bumpers, a WARN winch, snorkel, and a very nice sound system with awesome sound. It has about 14,300 miles, which is exceptionally low.
So I think I could get 17 EASY or maybe close to 20K for this.

Anyway,
I need AWD becasue I go to college in VT. So naturally, an Audi S4 comes to mind. I am also considering an STi. Right now, I really dont know what I like better. Compared to a second gen S4, the Suby has 50 more hp and weighs less. It is probably more involving and fun to drive. And I have also seen they go for a bit more money. The S4 on the other hand is obviously more luxorious, and it has the awesome German engineering. Since they are generally cheaper, I could buy one and mod it to be quicker than an STi anyway, probably.
Before I do anything, I would obviously test drive both cars.

So I have a few questions for you guys.

How easy are these cars to get power from? Are they expensive to buy parts for? What would be the best route to get some decent power? (I am assuming intake, exhaust, chip, tune)

And also, I will ask you what you think of your S4's. Why do you recommend an S4 over an STi, or maybe vice versa. What are this cars strengths and weaknesses?

Thanks,
Connor

 

Welcome to the forums.

The FAQ at the top of the page has tons of links in it

1. Power is so easy to get. "stage 2" which is a chip and exhaust, will make this car a COMPLETELY different car to drive in my opinion. After that there are things like downpipes and intercoolers which could free up a few HP make the car a little faster and more enjoyable to drive, but they are expensive. If you want faster than that your looking at new turbos.

2. I did pick it over an STI. One warning: you may fall in love with your s4, i dont know if sti people experience that... Its a great car, easy to make fast enough, nice interior. However its not too nice to your bank account so be careful. Your responses to this section are going to be HIGHLY bias as there is a big population of B5'ers here

 

The s4 is also a much nicer ride, even with the mods done to it imo, and HP is right, I'm in love with my car, even though sti's are great cars, and walk all over me in autox. But either way, I'd reccomend the s4.

 

Before purchasing my S4, I really really really dreamed of owning a 03-05 STI. But now that I bought my S4, I realize how dumb I was. The S4 is tons better, yea the STi is faster stock, but a buddy of mine owns one and says they are pieces of crap. And his was an 06. So he just stripped the interior since it was making noises and decided to make it a track car. Just get an S4, you wont regret it. Price wise, I think they are about the same if you get a nice low mileage B5 S4, compared to an 03-05 STi. I think any year Impreza before 03 are just plain ugly. And just get a Nogaro Blue S4 with Blue Alcantara Inserts and you are one step better than a Blue STi, looks wise.

 

All three of these guys have submitted excellent responses. I'll just add some thoughts of mine.

The STi will always be much more raw and "connected to the driver" than the S4 is. If all you want is speed, responsiveness and handling, then the STi will be the better bet. The S4 offers everything that the STi does, only it is much more refined, so it isn't quite as bleeding edge, ***** to the wall crazy like the STi is, atleast in stock form.

In terms of mods, the S4 is very moddable. There is a bit of a brick wall that you hit eventually, though. With the STi, replacing the turbo really isn't a mega-big deal. For the S4, replacing the turbos IS quite a big deal and quite an investment.

Early modding is easy for the S4 and will make it faster than 95% of the cars on the road. Getting a chip + downpipes + exhaust puts you at about 340 crank horsepower and around 390 lb/ft of torque at the crank. If you want much more than that, though, you hit that "brick wall" I was talking about earlier. You'll need to replace the undersized K03s for K04s, or GT series turbos, which becomes very expensive, very quickly. It doesn't help any that installation is difficult and very time consuming, which means a very expensive mechanic bill.

I wouldn't be surprised if you test drove the S4 and STi and felt that the S4 is quite a bit slower than an STi when both are stock. Keep in mind, though, that even with just a chip (a $600 investment) an S4 will have more power and ALOT more torque than a stock STi does. It won't necessarily be faster because of the weight penalty, but it certainly transforms into a different car when chipped.

A valid point to consider is also the STi's appearance. The S4 is very classy, and it looks like an understated performance car. The STi screams "I wanna race you" at every stoplight. So just consider whether you are going to get tired of the image that the car has amongst many people. It's not really a big deal because it's your car, so who cares what other people think, but it is something to consider.

So, I can't really recommend either one. While they do share fundamental similarities (front engine, AWD, 6-speed, turbo engine, 4 doors), their personalities are a little different. If you anticipate that everyday you get in the car you're going to want ultimate road feel, ultimate grip, not much sound-proofing, loud exhaust and just a general 110% performance drive, then get the STi. If you want 90% of what the STi offers in a more civilized, less pronounced, just as fast package, get the S4.

 

Everything you guys have told me is great help, and I appreciate it.

I have been looking around on ebay, and have realized a B6 S4 is not impossible, and I have a few questions regarding those. (i did a quick search, and did not find everything I was looking for)

-I realize these cars have the 4.2 V8 with 340 hp, but they also weigh a butt load more than a B5. Are they really worth it, if I have the resources to buy a B6 over a B5?
-Because they are not turbo'ed, they are probably harder to get power out of, at least for the same money a B5 would require. Is this assumption true?
-What are some potential problems/issues I should look out for with these cars?
-I see some B6's priced quite low (around 20 grand). Now granted this is largely due to high milage, but is the low price likely due to anything else I do not realize?
-How long do these cars last (in general) before they start to have problems (is 60,000 miles a lot? 100K? 150K ect...?)

Thanks a lot, and I realize some of these questions may be hard to answer (especially the one regarding the low priced ones and why are they priced low, always varies) but any little input is sure to help. Thanks.

 

The v8 s4 isnt nessicarly any better than the b5. It has more HP stock, but its more difficult to upgrade. Thats why there is such a huge following of b5'ers, Audi has also realized this. The new B8 s4 is a twin turbo v6 again.

IM going to use batteries analogy here. With the b6 you will hit a brick wall too. After a performance chip, a full exhaust (downpipes included), and an intake you just about out of luck unless you plan on MTM supercharging it (could cost you $20,000). The gains from these upgrades is significantly less than on the B5 because there are no turbos to work with. In my opinion the brick wall on the b5 is much cheaper and easier to get past. A turbo kit with fueling is $5500 from AWE, given you need a turboback exhaust and should be thinking about intercoolers, thats still less than the MTM supercharger. Also better fuel economy with the B5, that v8 is thirsty.

If the car is priced low it could be due to an accident, high miles, or some mechanical issue unknown to you. It could also just be someone wanting to sell the car quickly. My sister had a brand new 2004 Jetta GLI that was $25,000 she had to sell it in 05/06 to help pay for college (never gonna happen to the s4, ill take a semester off). I think she let it go for something like $14,000 because it HAD to go before tuition was due. Bottom line it its hard to tell, use carfax on any car you are seriously considering, testdrive, and have a mechanic look it over. If your comfortable with it go for it.

The v8 has shown itself to be a very robust engine. I have heard no complaints here about any milage. I would EXPECT 150k without any big problems but thats all in how you treat the car. You AND previous owners must keep on top of dealer services etc. The better its treated the longer it will last. However if i was getting a v8 it would certainly be a b7 not b6 (my prefrences)

A note on the b5. Your turbos will probably blow at somepoint. Many (dare i say most?) people dont make it to 150k on the stock turbos especially if its chipped and driven hard. When they do blow, its just about the same price for larger K04's, so right there you half way to stage 3.


http://www.audiworld.com/news/04/b6s.../content.shtml

That article is a kind of b5/b6 comparison, conclusion: stage 2+ b5 > b6

 

I'm not a car expert, so hopefully someone who is will step in. But I believe that with the B6 V8 S4s you will eventually hit a wall when it comes to performance. I think you can only do exhaust and a chip before you get into supercharging it. And that ain't cheap. So with the B5 you have better modding capabilities than the B6. Although the V8 you don't have to worry about your turbos blowing. A little story for you...
As I was checking out my S4 before I bought it, the owner was telling me how much he loved it. And he had gone out and bought a 04 V8 S4 to replace it. He told me that the V8 is fun to drive, but it doesn't beat the "funness" of the twin turbo. Plus he told me that the V8 can be awkward while driving around town or on a daily commute. Something about the powerband is funky and takes getting used to. And a few weeks after I purchased his old S4, he told me he totalled his new one and was thinking about getting a new Cadillac instead of another V8 S4. So I guess what I'm trying to say is just test drive both the V8 and Twin turbo S4s and see which one you like better.

And max mileage, I would say more than 200k. Cause I am sitting at 127k with my B5, and she is running like new, not to mention she still looks good. Plus I'm still running my original K03 turbos. And as long as you take care of your car, it will return the favor. Hopefully some of my rambling will help, and hopefully some of it is correct.

Dang, HP beat me to it. Oh well, it doesn't hurt to read some of that stuff again.

 

my uncle has a 07 sti, which is just as quick in a line, granted im tuned, and when i follow him thru corners, i simply cannot gain on him at all, or pull away. now im upgraded to bigger turbos, and better airfilter...i have not driven his, but have taken a ride in it. much harsher ride, but its quick, simple, and fun to ride in. my s4 is faster from 50 on up i would say, much heavier, but i think looks nicer, much more comfortable, better features, even he admits that. but its going to cost us each a ton to upgrade and maintain, but his is much newer. so upfront, im as fast, for about half the price.

either way, i will drive my audi til we have cars that fly, or i can afford an R8...stupid expensive medical school[:@]

 

Haha at least were in agreement!