Hey,
i have been reading these forums for a lil now and i just finially signed up so i can ask a few questions. I am getting a new car, getting rid of my supercharged lancer. I am lookin to either get the b5 s4 or a evo. i have driven the s4 and i do like it, i have not driven the evo yet but its a hella impressive car. Well heres what i feel with the s4, the andling feels real heavy. but i searched some supsension mods and if i do get the s4 i would get the bilstein shocks and struts and get springs. The car feels great its smooth, i like the response but y over an evo in you eyes? evo is cheaper to mod and handling is superb but the looks, s4 just grabs my attention.

 

Hey welcome to the forum! The S4 is going to have a much better feel to it in my opinion. You really can't beat the look and classiness of an Audi. With a $500 chip you can have it over 300 hp easilly. The S4 is very easy to mod. Once you own an Audi you'll never want to go back.

 

how come with audi's u get crank numbers with mods rather than power put to the ground?cause the chip from awe give su 70hp and 110trq to the crank. i just prefer to have whp numbers than hp. i guess i'm just used to whp and etc

 

Why are you singling out audi's?
I see lots of other mod sites that advertise crank horsepower with their mods.
Besides getting 70hp and 110 ft/lbs from a chip has got to be the biggest fastest bang for the buck out there.

 

There's 2 reasons for that. The primary is because, if you do have accurate crank numbers it's better to provide those than it is to provide WHP. WHP can vary so much from car to car, depending on drivetrain conditions, clutch used, tires (believe it or not), etc. Also, as an extension to the primary reason, providing bhp vs whp, in my opinion, sounds more professional, basically not like they just slapped on some changes to the car and then put it on a chasis dyno and called it a day... Instead, they really know the engine and have done their research.

The second is, of course, marketing. If you do know the bhp numbers, you'll use them. They'll be higher obviously, and when you're marketing a product you want to squeeze the facts in the upwards direction as much as possible.

I like knowing accurate bhp vs whp, because it makes me feel like they're "stock" numbers... I guess it's a psychological thing, but it works for me.

Oh yea, and as far as convincing you to get the S4 over the Evo... I've owned 2 "DSMs" (Chrysler/Mitsubishi's venture cars), a 90 Talon TSi AWD and a 94 Eclipse GSX. Performance wise, the 4G63T engine is great... These cars, for their price range, were amazing... But the Evo is a little more than it should, in my opinion. What sells it is its popularity. That's not to say it isn't a great car, but Mitsubishi quality doesn't merit the price. DSMs had very unreliable drivetrains, and even though the engines were very easily tuneable, they had major issues of their own. As an owner, you had to be under the mindset that you'd be rebuilding/swapping engine components every few months to at least once a year.

The interiors scream "Hey Look, I'm an overpriced Japanese car!"... That's always been a thing I've had against Mitsubishis.

Now, if you want out of the box all out performance, the Evo might be the right car for you... But if you care about the overall picture (performance, longterm reliability, luxury, class)... Don't even make this a multiple choice question. Just get the Audi.

 

i hear the b5 s4's have alot of issues. alot of pple tell me that it breaks down alot. a freind who had one had plenty of turbos go on him, others i kno who had it say they love it but just have to repair alot.. alot of high end car owners say i should go with an evo over the audi. but i'm doing my research first. thx

 

Well I think the problem with the S4's, as a baseline to being considered to have a lot of issues, it's the repair costs and not that it breaks down a lot. So far I have not read a single account of engine reliability issues. The turbos go out a lot on every turbo car in existance. I've owned an MR2 Turbo, 2 x DSMs, and now the S4. I think the CT26 (turbo in the MR2) was fairly relaible, but it would near the ends of its life at around 80k miles. The DSM's would go through turbos like women go through shoes. Be it the stock 14B, upgraded 16G, or the 2nd Gen Garrett T25 units.

The S4, from what I hear, is a hit and miss issue. You may get unreliable turbos or you may not. My S4 has 82k miles on the odo, on stock turbos, and no issues thus far... Although I am sort of wanting it to have issues in the next few months so I can get them replaced under warranty (extended).

If you look at the list of "known issues" for the S4, they're pretty mild compared to most other turbocharged performance cars. In particular, the DSM's (4G63T based ones to be specific) exhibit "crankwalk" issues, as well as major exhaust manifold problems, sometimes within the first 20k miles... An engine rebuild can be tedius and pricey if you don't have a warranty. Also, the above issues are in completey stock cars. Once you start modding your unreliability factor increases.

I think the most common problem on the S4, that people who don't know enough about it may think it's critical, is the TBB problem. That Y shaped hose that tends to break, but is like an $8 part... Not that difficult to replace yourself, either.

The fact that the S4 is so highly tuneable and still holds decent relaibility on stock internals is good enough reason to consider it over, say, an Evo or an STi.

You're doing the right thing by doing your own research, and in the end, it's all a matter of preference. There are other cars out there that are 100x more reliable than an S4, and others that are 100x less reliable. Same with the Evo. Through my experience with 4G63T based cars, I can tell you the reliability points on the Evo are down in my book... I love the cars, think they're great, but would never consider one as a daily driver. I would never pay anywhere near 30k for one, either.

The S4 is "just right" for me. It's an Audi, it offers subtle luxury, comfort, and great reliability/performance balance (relative statement, but based on my own personal experiences).

Keep us posted on which you choose. I'm just glad it's a choice between the S4 and the Evo, and not the S4 and an RSX... ;-) (no offense intended to anyone that owns one)