Fox News seeing the light?
#1
06-12-2009, 06:47 PM
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Constant State of Confusion
Posts: 5,942
Fox News seeing the light?
http://www.youtube.com/v/bxvunbIWNyI&hl=en&fs=1
That's the conundrum we face as "responsible" gun owners when you have peeps ranting like that in open forums it scares anyone, myself included.
Almost every nutjob that commits a masacre shooting (Columbine, VTech, etc) shows signs of anti-government and -social behavour in internet blog form.
Not to say everyone that rants like that will be the next to go postal and shoot up the nearest Walmart - but it does fit the MO of these characters. One reason DHS distributed their warning on the militant wingnut groups recently as Shepard Smith touched upon.
Thus making it harder for the responsible ones to fight stricter gun control laws.
Wonder what kind of emails he'll get now?
That's the conundrum we face as "responsible" gun owners when you have peeps ranting like that in open forums it scares anyone, myself included.
Almost every nutjob that commits a masacre shooting (Columbine, VTech, etc) shows signs of anti-government and -social behavour in internet blog form.
Not to say everyone that rants like that will be the next to go postal and shoot up the nearest Walmart - but it does fit the MO of these characters. One reason DHS distributed their warning on the militant wingnut groups recently as Shepard Smith touched upon.
Thus making it harder for the responsible ones to fight stricter gun control laws.
Wonder what kind of emails he'll get now?
#2
06-13-2009, 07:13 AM
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not pleasant ones, thats for sure. on gun control, for those who oppose, its in the constitution. we have the right to bear arms. for those who say its for a well regulated militia, just what exactly is a militia? a force to be summoned at any given time to oppose another armed force, perhaps? lets think for a minute, guns are banned. ok, i cant go to the store and buy a gun. but then again, i cant really go to wal mart and buy my daily fix of crack-cocaine. banning firearms would end up exactly like prohibtion. the government effectively created, without knowing, an enitre black market. not saying i support drug use, just making a innference. audi for life!
#3
06-13-2009, 10:11 AM
It's sad how angry people get over things that just aren't worth getting excited over. I saw a bumper sticker on a truck last week that said "Impeach Obama now!!!"
WTF??!!
He's only been in office a couple of months and certainly hasn't done anything wrong yet, but people who hate and feel the need to blame others are just eager for a target to vent their hatred at.
I'm a responsible gun owner and concealed carry permit holder and half the time I'm not looking for where the stereotypical armed robber will come from but rather the spree shooter our society is now burdened with.
WTF??!!
He's only been in office a couple of months and certainly hasn't done anything wrong yet, but people who hate and feel the need to blame others are just eager for a target to vent their hatred at.
I'm a responsible gun owner and concealed carry permit holder and half the time I'm not looking for where the stereotypical armed robber will come from but rather the spree shooter our society is now burdened with.
#4
06-13-2009, 10:49 AM
Audi90 would have loved this post. Guy's probably in jail or something... he is SO one of the wackjobs emailing Fox--that's for sure.
#5
06-13-2009, 12:49 PM
So whats the point of this thread palindari? You're upset with the people emailing FOX, or are you upset because FOX has got its panties in a bunch about it?
Personally i think everyone over reacts. Redline380 is correct about banning guns in america. It would just create a large scale black market, most of which will be bought by criminals and wackos, well maybe a few harcore patriots. Don't even get me started on marijuana. Does anyone realize how many tax dollars guns and ammunition creates for the US? If we just up and got rid of it, we would be even deeper in the hole.
Personally i think everyone over reacts. Redline380 is correct about banning guns in america. It would just create a large scale black market, most of which will be bought by criminals and wackos, well maybe a few harcore patriots. Don't even get me started on marijuana. Does anyone realize how many tax dollars guns and ammunition creates for the US? If we just up and got rid of it, we would be even deeper in the hole.
#6
06-14-2009, 01:26 AM
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Constant State of Confusion
Posts: 5,942
The point is that even Fox News is pissing off the far right nut jobs.
Up to this point you have Fox personalities like Hannity and Beck screaming "TYRANNY" and how the govenrment's going to take away your liberties. Now Shepard Smith is starting to see the hornet's nest that's getting stirred up from O'Reilly's anti-abortion rants and Hannity/Beck's anti-Obama shout-outs.
Here's the rub. Some people feel so passionately about things that they galvanize themselves to the point of inflexibility.
Do you think our founding fathers figured it all out overnight? Not no, but hell no. They fought, argued, bickered, negotiated and finally settled on accords that later became drafts of the documents we hold dear.
Are these accords worth fighting for - hell yes!
But what we're witnessing now is some uber-polarization that's becoming too, too divided. We, as a people, went from Republican and Democrats to Red and Blue states to right and left wings now to ultra liberal and conservative.
Where have we decided to become un-American? Because E. Pluribus Unum is plastered all across our nation - yet here we are... steadfastly pointing fingers throwing about accusations and fearing the worst and not accepting our best.
And that's a shame. For America was not founded on greed, but freedom. Freedom to be, feel and enjoy ourselves for what we are - Americans.
Yet again, the same freedom of choice have some fearing shadows and ignoring truths that are clearly obvious to even a blind man.
We, as a nation, have survived the terms of 42 Presidents, too numerous to count Senators and Representatives and a freaking plethora of judiciaries in our highest court.
Why can't we survive our 43rd?
Perhaps the media is to blame, or the economic times we are in, or maybe the deluge of reality television is finally taken it's toll on our psyche....
Either way, it's time to make a change. This isn't some "blow more sunshine up my ****" diatribe. This is a simple, ample gut check.
This crap has to end. It's time to start seeing things for what they are. No conspiracies. No hidden agendas. No sudden surge from the undead to give us a target rich environment (though I was truly hoping for the latter).
This is America. And if there is nothing history has taught us it's this - it repeats itself. So unless we want to end up like the Egyptians, Greeks, Romans, etc etc etc ad nauseum.... then we need to be American.
No left/right, blue/red, conservative/liberal or taste great/less filling camps.
Just Americans. Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness stuff...
That's my point!
Up to this point you have Fox personalities like Hannity and Beck screaming "TYRANNY" and how the govenrment's going to take away your liberties. Now Shepard Smith is starting to see the hornet's nest that's getting stirred up from O'Reilly's anti-abortion rants and Hannity/Beck's anti-Obama shout-outs.
Here's the rub. Some people feel so passionately about things that they galvanize themselves to the point of inflexibility.
Do you think our founding fathers figured it all out overnight? Not no, but hell no. They fought, argued, bickered, negotiated and finally settled on accords that later became drafts of the documents we hold dear.
Are these accords worth fighting for - hell yes!
But what we're witnessing now is some uber-polarization that's becoming too, too divided. We, as a people, went from Republican and Democrats to Red and Blue states to right and left wings now to ultra liberal and conservative.
Where have we decided to become un-American? Because E. Pluribus Unum is plastered all across our nation - yet here we are... steadfastly pointing fingers throwing about accusations and fearing the worst and not accepting our best.
And that's a shame. For America was not founded on greed, but freedom. Freedom to be, feel and enjoy ourselves for what we are - Americans.
Yet again, the same freedom of choice have some fearing shadows and ignoring truths that are clearly obvious to even a blind man.
We, as a nation, have survived the terms of 42 Presidents, too numerous to count Senators and Representatives and a freaking plethora of judiciaries in our highest court.
Why can't we survive our 43rd?
Perhaps the media is to blame, or the economic times we are in, or maybe the deluge of reality television is finally taken it's toll on our psyche....
Either way, it's time to make a change. This isn't some "blow more sunshine up my ****" diatribe. This is a simple, ample gut check.
This crap has to end. It's time to start seeing things for what they are. No conspiracies. No hidden agendas. No sudden surge from the undead to give us a target rich environment (though I was truly hoping for the latter).
This is America. And if there is nothing history has taught us it's this - it repeats itself. So unless we want to end up like the Egyptians, Greeks, Romans, etc etc etc ad nauseum.... then we need to be American.
No left/right, blue/red, conservative/liberal or taste great/less filling camps.
Just Americans. Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness stuff...
That's my point!
#7
06-14-2009, 07:09 AM
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: st cloud, mn. you too? hit me up...
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i agree with most of what you say. something i would like to add about the "surviving the 43rd" part is thats the thing about our system. we dont really have a choice whether to survive it or not. sure, there might be some discomfort along the way, but in the end our country will be 99% the same. not sure if youve ever seen the movie thank you for smoking, but the boy asks his father, what makes America the best country? the response is "because of our endless appeals system." funny, but true. no matter what happens, it can always be appealed, and, in most cases, changed. this is why our country can and will change, but never too drastically.
something you elude in your writeup is your answer to the age old question of freedom versus equality. i can obviously tell you favor freedom, as do i, however you are not blatantly stating it.
i will give you this very secret information which can never be relayed. america is getting more and more liberal every day (we are about a few decades behind western europe), and there is nothing we can do to stop it. only slow it. the libs come into power, make a few very drastically different laws, and then the conservatives get in and change as much as they can, even though it didnt undo every detail.
for my conclusion now.. havent you ever noticed shepard is comles liberal replacement? i have watched shepard a few times and have picked up on his liberalness. not saying its a bad thing (balance is a good thing), but FOX needed a little controversy
something you elude in your writeup is your answer to the age old question of freedom versus equality. i can obviously tell you favor freedom, as do i, however you are not blatantly stating it.
i will give you this very secret information which can never be relayed. america is getting more and more liberal every day (we are about a few decades behind western europe), and there is nothing we can do to stop it. only slow it. the libs come into power, make a few very drastically different laws, and then the conservatives get in and change as much as they can, even though it didnt undo every detail.
for my conclusion now.. havent you ever noticed shepard is comles liberal replacement? i have watched shepard a few times and have picked up on his liberalness. not saying its a bad thing (balance is a good thing), but FOX needed a little controversy
#8
06-14-2009, 05:48 PM
Well, wow. Palidari is finally watching "Fox Noise".
I do get frustrated watching the news in general, since the other news networks seem to lump ALL Republicans, Catholics, Christians and Conservatives in with the actions of the nut jobs that shoot up holocaust museums and stuff, but they don't take responsibility for their far left wing American Muslim that shot up a US Army recruitment center and killed a US soldier on our own soil. I just hope it's not going to get to be like in Iran, where Amedinejad is locking up all the opposing parties members for treason against him, even after he cut off their websites, phone service, etc to make it harder to organize for the election on Friday. All Obama has to do is have the government take over Fox News (and lock up Rush Limbaugh), and then he'll pretty much dictate whatever the media says or is allowed to say.
Anyhow, even as so many think there is too much corporate greed out there and that the government needs to be giving out free health care and regulating every other aspect of our lives to keep our costs down, YOU'RE ALL STILL WRONG.
We just need to let free market and capitalism do its thing. Healthy corporate competition will soon enough drive down the healthcare costs. The government has enough challenges to run itself now as big as it is. The government should not be competing with the private sector and be in the healthcare business. All it will do take more tax dollars out of our paychecks and run the national debt deeper.
The government doesn't need to be growing with more czars and more regulation, it needs to downsize to a level that can controll it's spending and be efficient at what it is there for - to protect Americans.
I do get frustrated watching the news in general, since the other news networks seem to lump ALL Republicans, Catholics, Christians and Conservatives in with the actions of the nut jobs that shoot up holocaust museums and stuff, but they don't take responsibility for their far left wing American Muslim that shot up a US Army recruitment center and killed a US soldier on our own soil. I just hope it's not going to get to be like in Iran, where Amedinejad is locking up all the opposing parties members for treason against him, even after he cut off their websites, phone service, etc to make it harder to organize for the election on Friday. All Obama has to do is have the government take over Fox News (and lock up Rush Limbaugh), and then he'll pretty much dictate whatever the media says or is allowed to say.
Anyhow, even as so many think there is too much corporate greed out there and that the government needs to be giving out free health care and regulating every other aspect of our lives to keep our costs down, YOU'RE ALL STILL WRONG.
We just need to let free market and capitalism do its thing. Healthy corporate competition will soon enough drive down the healthcare costs. The government has enough challenges to run itself now as big as it is. The government should not be competing with the private sector and be in the healthcare business. All it will do take more tax dollars out of our paychecks and run the national debt deeper.
The government doesn't need to be growing with more czars and more regulation, it needs to downsize to a level that can controll it's spending and be efficient at what it is there for - to protect Americans.
#9
06-15-2009, 06:53 PM
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Constant State of Confusion
Posts: 5,942
We just need to let free market and capitalism do its thing. Healthy corporate competition will soon enough drive down the healthcare costs. The government has enough challenges to run itself now as big as it is. The government should not be competing with the private sector and be in the healthcare business. All it will do take more tax dollars out of our paychecks and run the national debt deeper.
The government doesn't need to be growing with more czars and more regulation, it needs to downsize to a level that can controll it's spending and be efficient at what it is there for - to protect Americans.
The government doesn't need to be growing with more czars and more regulation, it needs to downsize to a level that can controll it's spending and be efficient at what it is there for - to protect Americans.
In general it works - but at certain levels the stakes are waaaay too great and companies collapsing can cause a great deal more damage. Another reason monopolies are bad.
Unfortunately, protecting its citizendry has ballooned out of control and caused our current level of governement to be what it is.
I agree on all these "czars" there's a reason for cabinet posts - not for psuedo politicians...
#10
06-16-2009, 12:02 PM
Shep provided a pretty lame example of "extreme" emails.
The birth certificate thing is somewhat ridiculous, but it is also ridiculous that hundreds of thousands of dollars have been spent to keep the certificate sealed from the public. It would be much easier to release the record and prove all of the critics wrong once and for all. The fact that this has not happened should make some rational people skeptical.
Labeling Obama as a socialist is also within reason. He will tell you to your face that he wants to "spread the wealth around." And nearly every economic decision he has made so far favours intervantion over capitalism. Just look how he treated the Crysler bondholders vs. the UAW.
So I dont think that there is anything irrational about that portion of the email.
As for the Fox personalities, they are no more extreme than the zombies on MSNBC who will never see the light. Are we not losing our liberties? Is goverments power not growing? Isnt tyrrany the very thing that the founders feared the most?
But Palindari is right, that we cannot afford to ignore the lessons of history. Thomas Jefferson is as good of a source on the designs of government as any...
The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not. -Thomas Jefferson
"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms..disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed one." - Thomas Jefferson quoting Cesare Beccaria, Criminologist in 1764. That was 230 years ago. -Thomas Jefferson
"The beauty of the second amendment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it." -Thomas Jefferson
The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.-Thomas Jefferson
I am not a friend to a very energetic government. It is always oppressive.-Thomas Jefferson
Most bad government has grown out of too much government.-Thomas Jefferson
What country can preserve its liberties if its rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance?-Thomas Jefferson
Were we directed from Washington when to sow and when to reap, we should soon want bread.-Thomas Jefferson
Experience hath shewn, that even under the best forms [of government] those entrusted with power have, in time, and by slow operations, perverted it into tyranny.-Thomas Jefferson
Timid men prefer the calm of despotism to the tempestuous sea of liberty.-Thomas Jefferson
I think myself that we have more machinery of government than is necessary, too many parasites living on the labor of the industrious.-Thomas Jefferson
A free people [claim] their rights as derived from the laws of nature, and not as the gift of their chief magistrate.-Thomas Jefferson
The two enemies of the people are criminals and government, so let us tie the second down with the chains of the constitution so the second will not become the legalized version of the first.-Thomas Jefferson
I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it.
Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have ... The course of history shows that as a government grows, liberty decreases.
Was the government to prescribe to us our medicine and diet, our bodies would be in such keeping as our souls are now.
The birth certificate thing is somewhat ridiculous, but it is also ridiculous that hundreds of thousands of dollars have been spent to keep the certificate sealed from the public. It would be much easier to release the record and prove all of the critics wrong once and for all. The fact that this has not happened should make some rational people skeptical.
Labeling Obama as a socialist is also within reason. He will tell you to your face that he wants to "spread the wealth around." And nearly every economic decision he has made so far favours intervantion over capitalism. Just look how he treated the Crysler bondholders vs. the UAW.
So I dont think that there is anything irrational about that portion of the email.
As for the Fox personalities, they are no more extreme than the zombies on MSNBC who will never see the light. Are we not losing our liberties? Is goverments power not growing? Isnt tyrrany the very thing that the founders feared the most?
But Palindari is right, that we cannot afford to ignore the lessons of history. Thomas Jefferson is as good of a source on the designs of government as any...
The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not. -Thomas Jefferson
"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms..disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed one." - Thomas Jefferson quoting Cesare Beccaria, Criminologist in 1764. That was 230 years ago. -Thomas Jefferson
"The beauty of the second amendment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it." -Thomas Jefferson
The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.-Thomas Jefferson
I am not a friend to a very energetic government. It is always oppressive.-Thomas Jefferson
Most bad government has grown out of too much government.-Thomas Jefferson
What country can preserve its liberties if its rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance?-Thomas Jefferson
Were we directed from Washington when to sow and when to reap, we should soon want bread.-Thomas Jefferson
Experience hath shewn, that even under the best forms [of government] those entrusted with power have, in time, and by slow operations, perverted it into tyranny.-Thomas Jefferson
Timid men prefer the calm of despotism to the tempestuous sea of liberty.-Thomas Jefferson
I think myself that we have more machinery of government than is necessary, too many parasites living on the labor of the industrious.-Thomas Jefferson
A free people [claim] their rights as derived from the laws of nature, and not as the gift of their chief magistrate.-Thomas Jefferson
The two enemies of the people are criminals and government, so let us tie the second down with the chains of the constitution so the second will not become the legalized version of the first.-Thomas Jefferson
I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it.
Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have ... The course of history shows that as a government grows, liberty decreases.
Was the government to prescribe to us our medicine and diet, our bodies would be in such keeping as our souls are now.