OMFG, dude!!![:@]LS1's do not make anywhere near 400 crank hp. They're around 350-355. End of story. Like 01A4T already said, 290-310 whpis the norm for LS1 cars. Whether it's a Camaro, Trans Am, Corvette, or GTO. Get your facts straight, or shut up. One or the other......



TKneedsS4- Sorry, but bolt-on for bolt-on, an LS1 car would ***-rape an S4. Any year S4. An SS w/ just H/C/I/E combo would wipe the floor w/ a Stage 3 B5 S4. That's just the way it is....

 

seriously, if you want more power for cheaper the ss is the way to go. there's no replacement for displacement, and as soon as you get that ls1 breathing a bit better and throw some cams in, those things are beasts. not to mention they are lighter. but they also get no traction, have sh!tty interiors, and you'll die in any type of serious wreck. which is why i'd take the s4 over the ss any day of the week.

and yes, no ls1 is putting out 400 stock

 

The proper venue to have this discussion is HERE:
https://www.audiforums.com/m_677855/...21/key_/tm.htm

 

Lol, it appears Im done arguing. A lotta "no way" and "I know better than some dyno" **** going on, pffff. Some of you guys dont know as much as you think you do.

Let it be known that you doubters know more than automotive machinists, engineers, and race shops. Ive provided the info and a link.

Are the camaros lighter? Theyre like 3800 lbs. An s4 has to be around that right? And they get traction at the track. Theres also a Mickey Thompson tire, the Et streets, that I havent tried yet, but will be soon. They are super soft, and just pass DOT. Almost 200 bucks a peice and they dont last long though.

Unless someone wants to argue about the dyno test, Im done here.

Hell just for fun, Ill give you ANOTHER link. This one is with accessories run, and showing the Corvette LS1 vs Camaro LS1 headers
corvette-396hp
camaro-384hp
http://www.carcraft.com/techarticles...o_numbers.html

I dont know what fuel they used. Probably vp 100 octane

And scg87, bolt on ss vs bolt on s4-s4 wins on the street. An ss will not get the traction. At the track, it will. I have 29x12.5 inch tires on my third gen with 700hp street tune. I shred them, with suspension work.
On the highway faster than 60mph, high hp rear wheel drive will overcome the traction benefits of AWD. I think my buddy's 300hp Talon will give me a run for my money for about 300ft.

 

Thats two links of pure ownage right there by TheBat.

 

^ How so???? Because he keeps back peddling and posting links to support HIS statements, which aren't even rebuttals to the ones made by others????


TheBat- Sorry, but you're crazy if you think a B5 S4 will stand up to an LS1 car mod for mod. It simply won't. Most races take place from a roll, where the Audi's drivetrain loss would make it's power deficit even greater. Even from a dig, the S4 would get handled. As long as the race goes hlfway through 2nd gear, it's over. That's all the time an LS1 car would need to make up the ground lost by a MUCH less powerful awd car outlaunching it.

And of course your car has traction issues, if it has 700hp. Traction is not a big issue for bolt-on LS1 F-Bods. My LT1 WS-6 hooked just fine, and LT1's make more low-end power than LS1's. And I have many friends w/ modded LS1's, who have virtually no issues hooking up on the street. Espes w/ DR's.Unless you're making really big numbers, any good street tire will do the trick.

 

Your right, but when I say built, I mean BUILT. A 500+ Camaro will have problems hooking. I think the corvette stock tires are 315 which are the same as my 12.5. With the traction control off those cars are greasy as well. And combined with a hard hitting auto or smacking your stick, traction is tough. This is why I think a BUILT s4 would take it on the street, but just my speculation.

A friend of mine has a 300hp Talon and races my buddy with a 350hp mustang. Mustang is roughly 600lbs lighter. Hardly any traction first and second gear, the Talon stomped him until he got going about 50-60mph and the Stang started creeping up. It was about a quarter mile race. Both are good drivers. As far as the roads go around here, 70-80mph are generally the top speed. On the highway, I believe the stang would wreck the talon.

Another problem with the camaro are the weak rear ends. Guys break them with stock motors and sticky tires. This is my situation, still a stock rear. Hopefully Ill have a nice one before the track opens in a month and a half.

What is not speculation are the facts that I have proved by two links of different magazines that have dyno'd 400hp. I dont know what your talking about here. Back peddling?
Of course Im supporting my statements.
And they are rebuttals to the statements made that "NO STOCK LS1 ENGINE MAKES 400HP". And yes I have seen guys on LS1 forums that stated they made 320rwhp.

Lets have another math lesson
400hp-20hp(accessories)=380hp
380hp-17%(driveline loss)=315.4rwhp

It sounds like you are just arguing for the sake of arguing. I dont know how to make this any more clear to you. Did you read the articles?

 

Your answers to back up your claims just don't conincide to what was being said about LS1's. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the debate was as to what LS1 cars made for power. It's 350-360. What that particular LS1 crate engine made on a dyno has nothing to do w/ what LS1 powered Corvettes and Camaros were making new back in 1998, lets say. There are several little variables that could easily attribute to the difference in power numbers. And you're just basing it on a given rwhp number, and a given percentage of drivetrain loss. That's just not a strong case to say they all make 'X' amount of horsepower. The average for LS1 cars is in the 300 ballpark. And that just not equate to a 400 crank hp car. As w/ nearly any car though, there are the factory freaks that make better than normal numbers. But they cannot be used when talking about the mass production population. That's all I'm saying. I'm not trying to argue in the negative sense, really. I'm just trying to explain my point of view......

 

All the ss cars were rated the same werent they? Your right that the average camaro Ls1 did not make 380-400hp. When I talk about something I tend to talk about the best, thats what I remember. If my car runs regualar low 10s in the quarter, but one cool dry day it runs a 9.9 sec, my car becomes a 9 sec car. How often doesnt change the fact that it is still a 9 sec car. And you have to SFI approved equipment for 9's every run after.
Im not really into those year camaros/firebirds, so I dont know too much about them, just the LS1 engine. But there were posts that "no LS1 makes 400hp and that is what I was really arguing with". I dont think there was a certain year we were talking about.
Whats different about an LS1 crate engine?

 

^ There were differences between the LS1's in different cars, actually. 98-00 LS1 F-Body's were rated differently from 01-02 F-Body's. The reason being is that the 00 and up cars used a different cam and the LS6's intake manifold. The GTO's LS1 and the Vette's LS1 were tuned differently from the Camaro/Trans Am's, and also attribute to slightly different power numbers. Again, it's not a huge difference by any means, but enough to cause an inconsistency when trying to pinpoint what LS1's as an engine produce. The minor tweaks between year models and particular cars account for slightly different numbers. As for the LS1 crate engine, I honestly don't know it's specs. It could use a different cam, intake setup, or ECU tuning. I don't know for sure. I was simply trying to explain the differences in numbers.




I understand what you're saying, and agree to an extent. If your car runs 9.90's, then I agree it's a 9 sec car. However, if that car is stock, then that does not automatically make every stock car a 9 sec car. It's all point of view, I guess, but it's just a slightly optimistic, misleading claim IMO. But I still see your point.......